Long Run Pace too Slow???? ...

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13 Replies Last post: Jul 14, 2007 9:10 PM by runawayjesse

Fishbowl

35 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

Jul 14, 2007 1:40 PM

Long Run Pace too Slow????

This is my first post here, although I have been lurking since I began running in October 2006. Forgive me if this is a stupid question. For a little background, I began running by taking a First Steps Class through my local chapter of Road Runners of America. I have been very consistent in my runs, averaging 15 miles per week, since then. I have never done speedwork or long runs, mainly just 4 or 5 miles each run, for 3 or 4 days per week. I have not had any major injuries (other than those sore shins and knees that most of us experience when we begin running).

My question is this..... I have found a training plan that I'd like to use on Runners World through its Smart Coach Training. I am training for an 8K (which I also ran last year) in December so I have plenty of time, but the paces that the plan gives me for my long runs is 12:12 per mile (as a sidenote, the Macmillan calculator also gives me about the same pace for long runs). I am a slow and steady runner averaging around a 10 minute mile (although the 5K time I entered to be used to compute my paces was 30:40 which I ran in March 2007). I tried a "test run" today at that 12:12 pace and it was impossible to slow down to that level. I am to assume that I should add walks into this long run to slow myself down? I am certainly not a speed demon, but anything slower than 11:00 per mile is very hard to manage. I am unable to even jog at a 12:12 pace.

What gives??? I feel I have a lot of opportunity for improvement and I am a female in relatively good shape so I am excited to formally train for something, but this was the most awkward pace I've experienced!

Any suggestions would be appreciated!!

Fishbowl

Girl In Motion

253 posts since
Feb 4, 2007

1. Jul 14, 2007 1:42 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

Punch in a new race time till you get the easy runs and tempo runs that suit your level. It's a common complaint with Smartcoach.

Fishbowl

35 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

2. Jul 14, 2007 1:49 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

Thanks for such a quick reply. I kind of thought the same thing about the Smart Coach program, but when the McMillan Calculator gave the same long run pace, I was confused since I know that it is a well respected pace calculator.

Nobby063

630 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

3. Jul 14, 2007 1:53 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

Here's my take; you cannot go too slowly to get benefit but it wouldn't hurt you to go a bit faster if it feels perfectly comfortable.

Any number anybody gives you is nothing but a guide and ultimately you should go by how you feel. It wouldn't hurt you to go slow; but it wouldn't hurt you if you go a bit faster either (as long as you feel comfortable with it).

One thing to note, though; there was this coach in Japan who trained a 2:26 female marathon runner, he would advocate real LSD type workout and had his runners go as slow as 12 minute pace (mind you; we're talking about professional runners here). He said if you CAN'T go that slow, there might be some imbalance in your running form. Sometimes it makes it difficult to go very slow if you have imbalance which you could sort of "hide" by going faster. Concentrate on your form and ask yourself some questions; is your center-line straight or crooked to one side (left or right), are you swinging your arms evenly (I swing my right arm a bit wider outside); is one of your legs stronger than the other, or longer than the other...??? Most of us are not perfectly aligned. But muscle strength imbalance from that could possibly affect your form.

Southern Man

757 posts since
Apr 19, 2006

4. Jul 14, 2007 1:54 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

You are probably not running enough miles or long enough for the smart coach or McMillans to be a very good tool for you. You are running your 5k at the same pace as your easy, everyday runs. That is not true for somebody with much experience. An easy run for a better trained runner should be 2-2.5 minutes slower than 5k pace (more or less).

That is probably not going to work for you. Just run your long runs at a comfortable pace so that when you are done you are comfortably tired. As you get fitter your race times should speed up.

Southern Man

------------------
We're on a road to nowhere. Come on along.

Nobby063

630 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

5. Jul 14, 2007 2:02 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Fishbowl:
Thanks for such a quick reply. <HR>

Man, we ain't got no life...

Girl In Motion

253 posts since
Feb 4, 2007

6. Dec 22, 2007 1:06 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

I'm a follower of McMillan's paces, and I see you punched in a March race time. Speaking for myself, I've lost a few minutes off my race time in April, which made inputting that time moot, and since your race was even before mine, you've probably improved a lot, too.

Punch a few times into McMillan's calculator, to get the numbers that are current for you. What is your usual easy run or long run pace? Make that appear in those respective areas.

Nobby (as usual) gives great advice, make sure the long run is, in fact, a comfortable pace.

http://This message has been edited by flobaby (edited Jul-14-2007).

Girl In Motion

253 posts since
Feb 4, 2007

7. Jul 14, 2007 2:05 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nobby:
Man, we ain't got no life...<HR>

Hey, speak for yourself... I have an appointment with the Queen at 4PM, and after that, jetting to Fiji for dinner, but not before repainting the Sistine Chapel.

runawayjesse

538 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

8. Jul 14, 2007 2:05 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

What is your heart rate on your 10 min mile runs. Many,many people squash their goals by first slowing down to a snail's pace. Read the giant "base building" thread for more info. I reccommend HADD for any beginner. Is the feeling on that 12 min pace extreamly easy? Well inigine you can RUN an 8 min pace with that same feeling. I can run today at efforts that it used to take me to walk from the couch to the firdge. Seriously today for the first time I did the first 5 miles of my long run at under 100 heart beats per minute. Thats a first for me. My point is at one point I too had to slow wayyy down.

If I were you I would focus the rest of this year on easy running and building volume. Do some short easy uphill sprints once or twice per week to keep up on your fast movers. Place the focus on building mileage. You can start with that 12 min pace and just try to let it get faster as you get fit or Many newer runners benefit from using a heart rate monitor because they aren't so sure of what easy feels like. When that race rolls around just enter it and do your best. I willing to bet money that if you can get your mileage up to aroud 30 ?? you will see a PR.

Girl In Motion

253 posts since
Feb 4, 2007

9. Jul 14, 2007 2:14 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

Yeah, agreed with the HR monitor to make sure your easy runs are at the right place. I told you wrong by saying punch your easy runs into McMillans, as a lot of people do go too fast, but using a HR monitor is a great way to police your pace.

Fishbowl

35 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

10. Jul 14, 2007 2:21 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

I really appreciate all of the advice. It will all certainly help me, I'm sure. I especially agree with Southern Man in that my race pace and my training pace are much closer than a more experienced runner's would be. When you run as slow as I do, it can be hard to slow down even more. My runs are 10:00 - 10:30 pace and my 5K PR is a 9:50 pace! Granted I have only run two 5k's and one 8K.

I was trying to follow a plan so that I could push myself a little harder. I generally enjoy my runs and I am sure that my race paces have improved since March, but I have never really pushed myself into that zone of being uncomfortable for very long. I guess that is why all of my runs are 4-5 miles at around a 10:00 pace. I am definitely tired after my runs, but not so much during them (although here in North Carolina the heat and humidity are killing me!)

Also, I guess I am beginning to bore of the same type of run every time I go out so I was hoping to "spice it up" with some tempo runs, intervals, and long runs.

Again, thanks so much for the help.

Fishbowl

Nobby063

630 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

11. Jul 14, 2007 2:22 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

quote:<HR>Originally posted by flobaby:
Hey, speak for yourself... I have an appointment with the Queen at 4PM, and after that, jetting to Fiji for dinner, but not before repainting the Sistine Chapel.<HR>

Say hi to Lizzy! ;o)

d3finition

96 posts since
Jan 7, 2006

12. Jul 14, 2007 3:18 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

Well, you might want to evaluate your running form. Running is apparently efficient at 180 cadence (steps per minute). So try running at 180 cadence and make your strides as tiny as you can. While I agree that guides are just mere numbers and that you should run comfortably, restricted to a certain minimum running pace due to your style, gait and form will mean that you will not be able to do more slow miles, which will impede your base building. Slowing down allows you to rack in more milege easily, thus allowing you to complete a certain MPW or distance to build up skeletal muscle before then working on speed. If you run too fast you might slow down your running progress by reducing the aerobic training you could have done.

runawayjesse

538 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

13. Jul 14, 2007 9:10 PM

in response to: Fishbowl

Re: Long Run Pace too Slow????

If your 5k pace is 9:50 than running distance runs at a 10:00 pace is insane. If anything even the mcmillian cals may be placing you too high.

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Jul 14, 2007 1:40 PM

Long Run Pace too Slow????

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