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Click to view masrun's profile Amateur 30 posts since
Mar 31, 2007

Jul 25, 2007 5:53 PM

Rasmussen pulled from Tour...

From Cyclingnews.com:

Rasmussen pulled out of Tour
Michael Rasmussen (Rabobank)
Photo ©: Roberto Bettini
Yellow jersey Michael Rasmussen (Rabobank) will not start Stage 17 of the Tour de France Thursday morning.

Team manager Theo DeRooy has withdrawn the maillot jaune from the Tour de France, allegedly because Rasmussen lied to the Rabobank team as to his true whereabouts when he missed his out of competition tests in June.

DeRooy will not withdraw the entire team, but will allow the riders to choose to start the stage tomorrow.

Rasmussen won Wednesday's Stage 16 finishing at Col d'Aubisque. He put 26 seconds 35 seconds respectively on Discovery Channel riders Levi Leipheimer Alberto Contador. Contador has been sitting in second place overall in the general classification and is also wearing the white jersey of the best young rider.

With Rasmussen gone, Contador will consequently wear the leader's yellow jersey in Thursday's 17th stage, a 188.5 kilometre race from Pau to Castelsarrasin. He has a one minute 53 seconds lead over Australian Cadel Evans of the Predictor Lotto team, with American Levi Leipheimer now up to third. Leipheimer is two minutes 49 seconds behind Contador.

Rasmussen's withdrawal comes only hours after Italian Cristian Moreni (Cofidis) was pulled from the Tour after he was confirmed as rider who tested positive for testosterone following stage 11 on July 19.

Just one day ago, Alexandre Vinoukourov tested positive for a blood transfusion. In response, his entire Astana team did not start stage 16 Wednesday.

Stay tuned to Cyclingnews for more information as the story develops.

SCREW CYCLING!!!!! The sport is pathetic anymore.
Click to view Paiko's profile Expert 40 posts since
Dec 21, 2004
1. Jul 25, 2007 10:35 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
And all this surprises you.....? Oh yeah I forgot, they all signed a letter "thou shall not dope". So we have all the holier than thou riders this year? Comon, what are they going to do? Not sign and not do the tours? Loose out on thousands of euros and get possibly get ousted from the team? Just another year on tour. Let's not forget that Michael hasn't tested positive for anything. Just buriatic SNAFUs. I am disappointed in Vino and I truly feel for the Astana and Cofidis teammates who will loose the most for things they aren't responsible for.

I seriously will miss the jousting between Contador and Michael. Like Lance and Ivan. Good stuff.
Click to view Dougie Fresh037's profile Legend 600 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
2. Jul 25, 2007 10:41 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
THIS IS JUST UNBELIEVEABLE!

So, he didn't get caught for doping but he missed his drug tests? I am not sure which is worse: taking the tests and getting busted or lieing to his team about skipping the tests.

Yes, F*CK the TdF.
Click to view dgrycz's profile Pro 185 posts since
Mar 23, 2007
3. Jul 25, 2007 11:15 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
This is getting pretty ridiculous. I seriously just got done watching Rasmussen win Stage 16, then I open up my labtop and sign on to CR and see he's booted. WTF? Just when I was getting into the TdF for the first real time.

The only silver lining here is that now, I think, Leipheimer has a decent shot at winning the tour. That guy seems like the ultimate professional and is supposedly a good time trialist.

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Click to view mplatzke's profile Legend 345 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
4. Jul 25, 2007 11:29 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
I'll be the contrarian here and say I think that, over the long run, this is exactly what the sport needed. I think it will force the the athletes to realize that they won't keep getting away with it and that they have to start racing clean and it will force the sports governing body to be even more determined in rooting out this plague. I think cycling has always been a non-mainstream sport (at least in the US) and while it will hurt severely in the short term, if it survives, I think it will be better for it in the long run.

I just think its sad that the major professional sports in the US will never be forced into the same realization and cleansing.

It really does make me wonder though. If the sport has been this dirty, Lance really did have to be a superhuman freak to have won all those tours clean verses all the dopers. Maybe I'm just hopelessly naive/optimistic thats even possible.

Mike
Click to view chrisuletz's profile Legend 549 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
5. Jul 26, 2007 12:27 AM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
Come on, Barry Bonds' head is gonna explode from too many steroids and people still watch baseball, plus most sports websites have the Bonds Watch now.
Click to view dragonsrouges's profile Legend 1,068 posts since
Aug 16, 2007
7. Dec 25, 2007 3:57 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
Um... I fail to see the surprise in this...

IMO you have to sets of biochemists working against each other and there will and probably have been (for a long while) been drugs and/or doping involved in this and most pro sports... I get a chuckle every time someone gets caught and people seem genuinely surprised... Part of me thinks they should just legalize it, let the dumb people take the drugs and reap the consequences. Eventually, the sport will clean itself out. They will never be able to police down hard enough on these people, for every drug test they find, another lab down the street has found another to crack it... There's no way they will ever have a chance to be on top of things.

In any case, TdF is not the end-all of cycling, so few people have the ability to get there (even on drugs), so there is not a lack of challenges out there in the cycling world.

All things considered, drugs or no drugs, doping or no doping, these are still admirable athletic feats that take many years of training and a large amount of athletic (physiological) talent.

http://This message has been edited by dragonsrouges (edited Jul-26-2007).
Click to view ussoccer's profile Legend 1,748 posts since
Dec 11, 2007
8. Jul 26, 2007 4:11 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
quote:<HR>Originally posted by dragonsrouges:
All things considered, drugs or no drugs, doping or no doping, these are still admirable athletic feats that take many years of training and a large amount of athletic (physiological) talent.<HR>

Therein lies the sadest part of this entire deal. Especially once these guys become household names. Because by that point they are also role models.
Click to view neildonnelly's profile Legend 524 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
9. Jul 26, 2007 4:21 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
On my way home from work I heard a radio interview with Stephen Roache (Only Irish winner of tour in 1987- and he commentates for European TV)
It made really interesting listening

He felt that during the 1980's about 5-10% of the tour riders were taking Drugs , this went up to a high in the late 90,s (due to improvements made by the biochemists) until the Astina affair in 1998 and he felt that upwards of 90% of the riders were on drugs - It dropped off again but at the minute he feels that there are about 50% of the riders probably doing drugs

He didnt say wheither or not he was doing drugs in the 80's

Interesting

Neil
Click to view dragonsrouges's profile Legend 1,068 posts since
Aug 16, 2007
10. Jul 26, 2007 5:09 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
quote:<HR>Originally posted by ussoccer:
[b]
Originally posted by dragonsrouges:
All things considered, drugs or no drugs, doping or no doping, these are still admirable athletic feats that take many years of training and a large amount of athletic (physiological) talent.<HR>

Therein lies the sadest part of this entire deal. Especially once these guys become household names. Because by that point they are also role models.[/B]


<rant>
I think we as a population don't take enough responsibility for our own actions... Role model or not, if you decide to admire a person who takes drugs to perform/win, it's your decision. If you go as far as doing the same in order to perform/win, then it is also your decision. Between watching the TdF on TV with household names winning and knowing that they are on drugs to going through the process of purchasing and administering drugs, well I think that's a huge step and either we are not taking enough responsibility for our actions or we are not giving ouselves (as human beings) enough credit... I don't know but some part of me thinks that if you're that stupid, then the consequences are all yours to reap. Eventually you'll learn, hopefully before it's too late.

All this talk about publicity and violence and peer pressure is all a good excuse for not looking at what's really wrong and who's really responsible... Whatever happened to clean and healthy lifestyle?

I don't think we were always this dumb as humankind but somewhere along the line, wow did we go off-track...

</rant>
Click to view ussoccer's profile Legend 1,748 posts since
Dec 11, 2007
11. Jul 26, 2007 9:02 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
quote:<HR>Originally posted by dragonsrouges:
<rant>
I think we as a population don't take enough responsibility for our own actions... Whatever happened to clean and healthy lifestyle?

I don't think we were always this dumb as humankind but somewhere along the line, wow did we go off-track...
</rant>
<HR>

Great points, dragonslayer.

So that I do not make an ill-formed conclusion regarding any situation or issue, I try to take the time to understand how we got to where we are, because deep in my core I know that no issues are black and white, as if overnight somebody decided to say, "Hey, let's eat Peanut Butter because it will give us that edge."

In the case with almost all of sport, including but definitely not limited to some Tour d' France riders, maybe Barry Bonds and others, any other sports figure you can think of who's been linked to illegal means to gain an edge over competitors, sports figures do not decide over night to do illegal things to gain an edge. The more competitive the field, the more time goes by, weaker athletes in mind and body will look to something other than hard work and grit to gain an edge. They will still put in their time, but they will seek alternative boost to equal or excel. That is sport.

Why do they do it? Competition. It all starts with healthy competition. But where does it go awry? Maybe it is commercial. Consider this (no facts, just guessing from experience): Money. Money enables would-be cheaters to cheat. Consider soccer in the US. Kids growing up historically had very few places to graduate to. NASL (old soccer legal that folded in late '80's) was long gone. MLS pays little to nothing, and all the good players go to Europe. And even if you were good enough to make a team, even today if all you are is an average player, you will make, at most, $25K per year. Yeah, no kidding. Steriods and EPO and blood doping is not a problem, probably because there is no money in the sport. Look at other sports with similar ground roots -- it's all the same. Little to no problems with steriods.

Now insert money and you have football, baseball, Tour d' France, etc.

But the thing is, for the athletes close to "making it", it doesn't happen over night. Time goes by when they climb up the ranks. Eventually they get coaching, a team, a nutritionist, and a buddy in the system who is either doing something illegal or promotes doing something illegal because, well, everybody is doing it. And also, hey, this is so new it will not show up on any tests, because, hey, it's not even banned yet. Weaker athletes, both mental and physical, will be more apt to bite.

That's how sport gets polluted with illegal substances. Perhaps it really is all related to money.

Now that I've agreed there's a problem in most popular sports, what can we do about it.

Dragonslayer is right. We, as a society, need to act and act together. Not only must teams who catch these cheats strike that player from the team, but coaches must call players out, players must call players out, fans must call players out, media must call players out, sponsors must call players out... we as a society must take responsibility to call the evil-doers out. There's no other way.

Right now the Tour is in the middle of transition. This is nothing new. They've been in the middle of this for a few years. The good news is that more and more cheats are being caught. And more will. There has been uproar to cancel the Tour because, well, with the top guys out and even top teams, nobody is left. That's hogwash. The athletes left are the real deal until prooven otherwise. The Tour MUST go on, for it is a freedom of speach and a sporting rite. To cancel the Tour would be akin to refusing to go outside your house after 911. It just isn't right. You don't surrender what it means to be human when one thing goes wrong, but at the same time, we have to take responsibility of our own actions -- actions as a human race -- when athletes cross the line. This happens all the time in other aspects of life; just, it hasn't happened as much as it needs in the sporting world.

One of the sports I most enjoy is woman's soccer at the high school, collegiate, and professional level. I enjoy it so much because it is pure, through and through. In any given game, not an athlete on the field is there for the money, because, truth be known, there is no money. They fight for a head ball because they love the sport. The slide for the ball because the want the ball and want to distribute it to a teammate; not because if they do enough slide tackles some team will offer them a new contract.

The doping and cheating in cycling is a great shame. But the Tour is far from over. We are in the middle of a cleansing period. In order to remove anything from life, the first part is identifying the problem, second is noticing it when it happens, third is crafting an appropraiate alternative action to take when it does happen, and the fourth is acting on it. It's hard to tell where we are right now, but we are someplace. If more and more people take more responsibility, especially sponsors with the money and influence of coach and captain, we will get to cleaning up sport and making it more pure sooner. This is also why I like the Olympics, or at least why I used to like the Olympics. It is filled with more amatuer ahtletes in bizarre sports that will never see much more than a dollar of sponsor money.

Long live the Tour. Give it a couple of years and it will be closer to clean. We are only in the middle of change. But don't be patient, for not being patient is a form of take responsibility and letting those in charge know that their cheating is not tolerated.
Click to view RunninRob's profile Expert 51 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
12. Jul 27, 2007 8:05 PM in response to: masrun
Re: Rasmussen pulled from Tour...
The fact that UCI is taking such a stand for the sport and prompting so many Americans to denounce a single Grand Tour leads one to wonder why so many still attend professional baseball, basketball, and football. Examine the current situation for each commissioner of these leagues.

Imagine year round testing of baseball players, police hotel searches of NBA players, and post game blood analysis of NFL players.

RR