quote:<HR>Originally posted by reboot:
There is nothing wrong with meat eating in any way. Vegetarianism is more likely associated with serious eating disorders than healthy lifestyle - particularly on this forum (not that a vegetarian diet cannot be healthy).
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Again, you base this statement on what exactly? This is an opinion, as much as the opposite view is also simply an opinion, which is what my first post was attempting to point out. There is scientific literature going in both directions, although frankly there is quite more going in the direction of "reducing meat consumption is beneficial to health" than "reducing vegetable consumption is beneficial to health or increasing meat consumption is beneficial to health." By what measure do you decide that your ethical decisions ("what's right" vs. "what's wrong") are superior to anyone else's? Is there nothing wrong with eating meat if you're a Seventh Day Adventist? If you're a Buddhist? When your doctor tells you eating meat is going to lead to an early grave?

I have not seen evidence on this site that vegetarianism is linked with eating disorders, I've seen rather that RUNNING combined with youth appears to be linked with eating disorders. Eating disorders are rampant among young athletes and vegetarianism can certainly be used as a cover for that, but so can diets that exclude bread, fruit, sugar, or anything else. We have as large a share of those here, too! Does every person on the South Beach Diet, the Atkins Diet, or the salmon-and-ghee diet have an eating disorder? Some do and some don't, but it is inappropriate to make associations between those diets and eating disorders on a general level. You show both incredible ignorance in making such sweeping statements and a complete lack of respect for adults who are as capable as you are of making sound decisions about what they put in their bodies.

The majority of vegetarians and vegans on this board appear to live quite healthfully, eat abundantly, and keep on running hard.

Sorry for the long OT.

I mostly agree with Ariann - claiming that vegetarianism is more associated with "serious eating disorders" than a healthy lifestyle is complete BS.

But even though I almost always keep my mouth shut about it, I do have a measure to believe that my vegetarian diet is more ethical than the alternative - the impact of a vegetarian on the environment is much, much less. In fact, the primary reason I stick to a vegetarian diet IS that it's an ethical choice (maybe one of the few things that I do right in this world).

As far as the original topic, I think extra-lean beef is the best choice. It would very possibly be healthier for me to eat it as well, though I won't. I just know from having cooked hundreds of pounds of both ground beef and ground turkey that the turkey is such foul-smelling stuff that I don't think I could bring myself to eat it.

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Consider trying Boca Crumbles or Morningstar Farms ground meat substitutes. It tastes the same when mixed in dishes and there's no fat to drain off of it.

Jennifer

If the fat and cholesterol numbers are similar, I'd go with the beef because it has more iron and zinc.

Nice, lean venison.

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Ariann:
The focus is on the unhealthful aspects of meat and reducing them, not increasing the possible healthful aspects, which for the most part can be gleaned from other foods without risking the health problems associated with eating diets high in saturated fat and cholesterol.

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We are talking about LEAN MEAT.
We are not talking about an entire diet and daily consumption of meat, nor are we talking about diets high in fat and cholesterol.
Moderation in everything is the key.
I have leand meat once every six months. I just do not like it, but that does not mean I think it's bad.

Everyone seems to be very concerned about the fat level in these meats. Using bigapplepie?s numbers for a 4 oz serving, the ground beef represents only 12% of the DV of fat and 15% of the DV of saturated fat. Certainly both numbers are well within the Dietary Guidelines for a healthy diet and even with a reasonable level of fats distributed over the other foods of the day, a serving of ground beef (or turkey) can easily form part of a healthy diet. The basic nutritional makeup is:

Calories 170 Calories from Fat 72
Total Fat 8g 12%
Saturated Fat 3g 15%
Cholesterol 61mg 20%
Sodium 80mg 3%
Total Carbohydrate 0g 0%
Protein 23g 46%

True, you would not likely consider it healthy to sit down and eat ground beef as a snack. But to illustrate the blatant bias against meat by the vegetarians on this forum, let me point out the following that was posted recently and characterized as a healthy and nutritious snack:

?-roasted chickpeas (dump 2 cans of drained and rinsed chickpeas into a big bowl with 2 tbsp canola oil and whatever seasonings you like to taste. Bake on a cookie sheet for about 45-60 minutes at 400*F).. They make a great crunchy, salty snack that you can munch on almost all night without feeling guilty, because chickpeas are very high in protein and fibre.? (emphasis is mine)

It passed without comment except for the following:

?MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM. That sounds really delicious! Something I never thought of--thanks!?

The basic nutritional makeup of 100 g serving would be approximately:

Calories 243 Calories from Fat 135
Total Fat 16g
Saturated Fat .1g
Cholesterol 0mg
Sodium ??mg
Total Carbohydrate 22.6g
Protein 5g


The fat content of this snack is higher than ground beef and while the ground beef fat type is not the best, nobody is suggesting ground beef be munched on all evening as a healthy snack.

My point is that even the lowly ground beef patty can be part of a healthy diet while the biased view of a vegetarian "healthy" food does not make it so.


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gotta run...

quote:<HR>Originally posted by reboot:
[b]

True, you would not likely consider it healthy to sit down and eat ground beef as a snack. But to illustrate the blatant bias against meat by the vegetarians on this forum, let me point out the following that was posted recently and characterized as a healthy and nutritious snack:

?-roasted chickpeas (dump 2 cans of drained and rinsed chickpeas into a big bowl with 2 tbsp canola oil and whatever seasonings you like to taste. Bake on a cookie sheet for about 45-60 minutes at 400*F).. They make a great crunchy, salty snack that you can munch on almost all night without feeling guilty, because chickpeas are very high in protein and fibre.? (emphasis is mine)

It passed without comment except for the following:

?MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM. That sounds really delicious! Something I never thought of--thanks!?

The basic nutritional makeup of 100 g serving would be approximately:

Calories 243 Calories from Fat 135
Total Fat 16g
Saturated Fat .1g
Cholesterol 0mg
Sodium ??mg
Total Carbohydrate 22.6g
Protein 5g


The fat content of this snack is higher than ground beef and while the ground beef fat type is not the best, nobody is suggesting ground beef be munched on all evening as a healthy snack.

My point is that even the lowly ground beef patty can be part of a healthy diet while the biased view of a vegetarian "healthy" food does not make it so.


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First, I'm pretty sure you're totally forgetting about the giant thread on hummus where we all argued (including you) whether or not hummus (basically chick peas) is healthy. Probably people knew the discussion already happened so why comment? Something like hummus is especially healthful for a vegetarian because we don't get protein from meat, so a well balanced vegetarian will get protein from another high-quality source like chick peas, legumes, nuts, etc.

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Second, every vegetarian I know agrees that ground beef (or any other meat) CAN be part of a healthy diet, but it doesn't HAVE to be. You seem to be the biased one that thinks the only two choices are to eat meat or have an eating disorder. It's not cool to lump everyone together "the biased view of a vegetarian"....one person's comment does not mean that every person in that category (vegetarians in this example) believes it.

A quick Google search does not constitute knowledge on a topic.