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Click to view MrPHinNJ's profile Pro 139 posts since
Oct 10, 2007
30. Oct 31, 2007 6:23 PM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by mark capparella:
One of the better "take-homes" I got from the show was the fact that exercise ALONE is not likely to lead to weight loss. As a 50 mpw runner, I know that if I'm not careful, my weight can creep up pretty quickly if I let my diet get away from me. I'm sick of hearing "you must be able to eat whatever you want" from people when I really can't. <HR>


I noticed that they mentioned that, too. So true. I've never been able to lose weight without watching my diet, no matter how much I run.
Click to view rbbmoose's profile Legend 324 posts since
Oct 12, 2007
32. Oct 31, 2007 6:50 PM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by RunTWM:
Good for you, Ray, and, of course, lots and lots of people will finish ahead of you! .<HR>


Nope - you're wrong there too - not many finish ahead of me and most of them are younger.

Sorry, I'm competitive - if it seems like I disrespect the slower runners, I don't - but I respect excellence and the hard work required to achieve it more.

Ray
Click to view Brian McN's profile Legend 240 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
33. Oct 31, 2007 8:50 PM in response to: Ice Cream
I have to say after watching the show I really felt for those people and I do think it was inspiring seeing where they had started from. Maybe some of them will go on to a higher level of competition maybe not. They felt a level of personal accomplishment and that's all that mattered to them. Very cool.
My first Marathon was a 4 hour one and this weekend I'll be shooting for sub 2:40. My 4 hour Marathon still feels like a huge accomplishment to me and nobody can take that away.
To each there own. How can 99.999% of us feel so superior to other runners out there when there are guys averaging sub 5 minute pace for the Marathon? We all have our own goals. Leave it at that.
Click to view Mugulian's profile Amateur 24 posts since
Sep 26, 2007
34. Oct 31, 2007 10:18 PM in response to: Ice Cream
I thought that the show did a good job in terms of showing people what is possible. Sure, no one in the group ran a BQ but they did it. Are some of you trying to say that just because Im new to this and working on my long term goal of a marathon that I should quit now because I may never run a sub 4 hour? Im working hard and have long term goals in mind and do my best to achieve what my body is capable of. They may not be fast, but they got off the couch and found the finish...thats better than most people.
Click to view maryt091's profile Legend 806 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
35. Nov 1, 2007 5:48 AM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by rbbmoose:
The number of runners has grown and I suspect (although I could be wrong) the number of charity runners. The course (and Hopkinton) can't support it. It used to mean something when you said you ran Boston - but now everyone's weird uncle Harold "ran" it as part of an effort to cure Rabies and he did it wearing bowling shoes, wearing a top hat and smoking a cigar. Not that there's anything wrong with that - hats off to to Harold and his charity - but couldn't we have one pure "Runners" marathon to go with the thousands of charity events?

Ray
<HR>

Ray
Seems to me the percentage of charity runners to qualified runners used to be higher in years past. The total number of runners has grown, but the number of charity runners has grown much less. People seem to think you just pay a charity you can get a number. That's not true.

The charity runners make up about 10% of the total runners, maybe even less - a very small percentage and they bring in millions for charity. I was at Dana Farber Cancer Research Center in Boston a couple of years ago and couldn't help but notice one wing has a huge mural of the Boston Marathon in tribute to the large amount of funding their programs get from the Dana Farber runners. Sure it is possible to hold charity drives and just go out and ask people to support a cause, but it's a whole lot easier to raise money if you are "earning" it by running Boston than it is to just go around asking for money. The charity runners help thousands, probably millions of other people through the research their contributions bring in; who do you help as a qualified runner other than yourself?

Let's put this in perspective. If you were just looking for smaller races with good compeittion but with a less publicized charity element you could surely find several. But you want the prestige of running Boston. OK, but why should we want you? Does your presence in Boston help the local communities who support the race? Does your presence help support the many local charities that benefit from the race? Does your presence make a difference in the likelihood that more and better cancer treatments will be found sooner? Why should we want you to clog up our local streets just because you can run a little faster than some of the charity runners who do so much more for us? Maybe instead of whining about charity runners you should be thankful you have the opportunity in run Boston with just the justification that you are faster than the average runner.
Click to view MrPHinNJ's profile Pro 139 posts since
Oct 10, 2007
36. Nov 1, 2007 6:24 AM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by maryt:
Let's put this in perspective. If you were just looking for smaller races with good compeittion but with a less publicized charity element you could surely find several. But you want the prestige of running Boston. OK, but why should we want you? Does your presence in Boston help the local communities who support the race? Does your presence help support the many local charities that benefit from the race? Does your presence make a difference in the likelihood that more and better cancer treatments will be found sooner? Why should we want you to clog up our local streets just because you can run a little faster than some of the charity runners who do so much more for us? Maybe instead of whining about charity runners you should be thankful you have the opportunity in run Boston with just the justification that you are faster than the average runner. <HR>


The prestige of Boston allows them to raise all that money for charity. Part of the prestige is BQ'ing. So for that reason, you want him there. In a backhanded way, through hard work, he is helping a charitable cause.

Personally, I would only run Boston if I qualified. I can contribute to charity elsewhere. But I don't have a problem with the charity runners. They are following the rules of entry just as the BQ'ers are. Both are to be commended. What's the big deal?
Click to view rbbmoose's profile Legend 324 posts since
Oct 12, 2007
37. Nov 1, 2007 6:49 AM in response to: Ice Cream
OK - Sorry if I gave the impression I was bent out of shape about the charity runners. I'll plead taper induced insanity. In my opinion Boston had more prestige pre-1994 when you really had to qualify to get in. Just my opinion and you are welcome to yours.

But its not a big deal to me - I've run Boston more than once, no desire to do it again - The charities are great but I'll donate money to directly (or through race fees) and I never cash prize checks...

I don't begrudge anyone the oppurtunity to run and I hope more do.

Peace and good karma to everyone (except the guy who thinks lots of people are going to finish ahead of me - he's welcome to come to Philly in a couple weeks and try).

Ray
Click to view mrinertia's profile Legend 1,356 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
38. Nov 1, 2007 7:16 AM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by maryt:
[b]
Originally posted by rbbmoose:
The number of runners has grown and I suspect (although I could be wrong) the number of charity runners. The course (and Hopkinton) can't support it. It used to mean something when you said you ran Boston - but now everyone's weird uncle Harold "ran" it as part of an effort to cure Rabies and he did it wearing bowling shoes, wearing a top hat and smoking a cigar. Not that there's anything wrong with that - hats off to to Harold and his charity - but couldn't we have one pure "Runners" marathon to go with the thousands of charity events?

Ray
<HR>

Ray
Seems to me the percentage of charity runners to qualified runners used to be higher in years past. The total number of runners has grown, but the number of charity runners has grown much less. People seem to think you just pay a charity you can get a number. That's not true.

The charity runners make up about 10% of the total runners, maybe even less - a very small percentage and they bring in millions for charity. I was at Dana Farber Cancer Research Center in Boston a couple of years ago and couldn't help but notice one wing has a huge mural of the Boston Marathon in tribute to the large amount of funding their programs get from the Dana Farber runners. Sure it is possible to hold charity drives and just go out and ask people to support a cause, but it's a whole lot easier to raise money if you are "earning" it by running Boston than it is to just go around asking for money. The charity runners help thousands, probably millions of other people through the research their contributions bring in; who do you help as a qualified runner other than yourself?

Let's put this in perspective. If you were just looking for smaller races with good compeittion but with a less publicized charity element you could surely find several. But you want the prestige of running Boston. OK, but why should we want you? Does your presence in Boston help the local communities who support the race? Does your presence help support the many local charities that benefit from the race? Does your presence make a difference in the likelihood that more and better cancer treatments will be found sooner? Why should we want you to clog up our local streets just because you can run a little faster than some of the charity runners who do so much more for us? Maybe instead of whining about charity runners you should be thankful you have the opportunity in run Boston with just the justification that you are faster than the average runner. [/B]


You have a point, however all of that charity could be raised in other marathons. One of the coolest things about Boston is the need to qualify (it would be cool to see more races like that). When people run Boston on a charity ticket, it's like showing up at a black tie event wearing jeans and a wife beater and being allowed in because you paid some extra at the door to get in.

I'm all for charity and anyone who want to run for any reason is fine with me, but I feel that as more and more people take to the roads (which is awesome) I think a few events should be reserved for runners of a higher caliber.
Click to view Brian McN's profile Legend 240 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
39. Nov 1, 2007 7:22 AM in response to: Ice Cream
I ran Boston in 1991. I remember the bandit runners in the hundreds. They were not shunned and were accepted by the BAA at the time. They received everything but were not given a official time and finisher medal.
Rather than fight it BAA decided to change things at the 1994 race and let everyone in on the 100th race regardless of qualifying. This in my mind is when that boat sailed away and Boston became an open race. It was very different back then. Now BAA doesn't fork the money out like the other major Marathons to draw in the elites. London took all of the best runners last year away from Boston. To me this is the most troubling news of all in how this race has changed.
I know people who can get a number from BAA without being involved in a charity. They simply know someone who is in the club and there are a lot of extra numbers floating around.
They should open it up to everyone and have qualifying times for automatic entry only like the other major Marathons.
I don't mind the people on the show being in Boston. They lined them up in the back of the second wave start. They are not bothering anyone back there.
Anyone who has the right connection can get into that race regardless of time. So why do we hold it up on a pedestal like we do?
Click to view Kevin Shaw's profile Pro 158 posts since
Nov 3, 2007
40. Nov 1, 2007 8:23 AM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by mrinertia:
....I think a few events should be reserved for runners of a higher caliber.

<HR>



Oh, but there are events reserved for runners of a higher caliber. They are called the Olympic Trials and the Olympic Games

------------------
Kevin
(aka TecDad)
My home page[/URL" target="_blank">

"Every morning in Africa, an antelope wakes up. It knows it must outrun the lion, or it will be killed. Every morning in Africa, a lion wakes up. It knows it must run faster than the antelope, or it will starve.
It doesn't mater whether you're a lion or an antelope - when the sun comes up, you'd better be running."
Click to view mrinertia's profile Legend 1,356 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
41. Nov 1, 2007 9:58 AM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by tecdad:
[b]
Oh, but there are events reserved for runners of a higher caliber. They are called the Olympic Trials and the Olympic Games

[/B]<HR>


Well said. Now we just need a few intermediate levels, like maybe one that requires a guy like me to qualify by running, oh, say a 3:15 marathon.
Click to view Tamalina's profile Legend 1,594 posts since
Aug 14, 2007
42. Nov 1, 2007 1:01 PM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by rbbmoose:
And as this show demonstrates ANYONE can finish a marathon. - it may be a bit unpleasant, but its really not that difficult.

Ray
<HR>


interesting conversation on this topic over here. this statement here sort of struck me as something I didn't expect to see. As someone who has yet to do a marathon, i guess it sort of blows the wind out of my sails that when I do finally do it, it's really not that big of a deal because "anyone can finish a marathon and it's not all that difficult" . . . .
Click to view dg12002's profile Legend 622 posts since
Aug 26, 2003
43. Nov 1, 2007 2:06 PM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by maryt:
QUOTE

I was at Dana Farber Cancer Research Center in Boston a couple of years ago and couldn't help but notice one wing has a huge mural of the Boston Marathon in tribute to the large amount of funding their programs get from the Dana Farber runners. Sure it is possible to hold charity drives and just go out and ask people to support a cause, but it's a whole lot easier to raise money if you are "earning" it by running Boston than it is to just go around asking for money. The charity runners help thousands, probably millions of other people through the research their contributions bring in; who do you help as a qualified runner other than yourself?

<HR>


What a guilt trip!!! You're saying all these research money making machines are doing good? Come on, they generate wealth for themselves and do little good. They do make very expensive chemicals synthesized from natural compounds with crazy side effects. They have to do that in order to profit.
Click to view rbbmoose's profile Legend 324 posts since
Oct 12, 2007
44. Nov 1, 2007 2:12 PM in response to: Ice Cream
quote:<HR>Originally posted by TammyM:
interesting conversation on this topic over here. this statement here sort of struck me as something I didn't expect to see. As someone who has yet to do a marathon, i guess it sort of blows the wind out of my sails that when I do finally do it, it's really not that big of a deal because "anyone can finish a marathon and it's not all that difficult" . . . .


<HR>


In hindsignt, I probably should said that it is difficult, but doable for just about everyone - With todays relaxed finishing standards even the out of shape can finish if they have decent weather and are willing to put up with some misery. Racing the marathon is a different story - I've done 15 with varying degrees of success and still don't have it figured out.

I do know that proper base and training can make the race alot more enjoyable and it doesn't have to be a hugely painful experience. Really finding and readching your potential in the marathon can be very difficult, but also very rewarding - IMHO many don't even come close - and the NOVA guys could all do much better if they trained longer, laid off the twinkies and cigarettes etc.

Ray