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Stevie Ray Lopez

532 posts since
Dec 3, 2007

15. Aug 2, 2005 7:18 PM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Robin, the #3 guys are correct. Gallowalking only helps cause it forces you to pace yourself better. <HR>

That's indeed the theory. Now I'd like to see the proof.

I realize that runwalkers take a lot of **** from a subset of runners. I'm sorry about that. I take a little **** from a subset of runners too, even though I generally run the whole way, because 1) I'm slow and 2) I run 'too many marathons'.

The thing is, I seem to take **** from the runwalkers as well just for having the temerity to wonder if their claims are indeed true. I'm not calling BS on these claims... I'm just looking for some data.

As for whether one can claim to have "run" a marathon if one walks 1/11 of it, well, to me that's a debate for another day. It completely depends on how you define "run", and it is doubtful that the different sides will ever agree. It's only meaningful to you (or to me) if you (or me) are interested in the judgment of others. Sometimes I am, and sometimes I'm not.

robintravers

371 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

16. Aug 2, 2005 7:31 PM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by srlopez:
Now I'd like to see the proof. The thing is, I seem to take **** from the runwalkers as well just for having the temerity to wonder if their claims are indeed true. I'm not calling BS on these claims... I'm just looking for some data.<HR>

Bingo! Me too! (*group hug*)

As a physician, I can assure you that whenever there are 2 groups with opposing theories who fight tooth and nail over their dogma, it is often simply because there is a sorry lack of evidence to support either side.

I'd love to hear more from the physiologists out there. I'm sure there is data out there, perhaps someone more skilled than I can sort through it? It does occur to me that there are other endurance sports in which rest periods are automatically built-in. Cycling, for example, offers riders rest on descents (if you can call screaming down a hill at 60 mph a "rest"), and long distance speed skating, in which the long glide and slow cadence is meant to offer rest for the muscles before the explosive stroke. Perhaps the data related to those other sports might be brought to bear on some of these questions. It's always good to question dogma.

--Robin

Who Dey010

173 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

17. Aug 3, 2005 7:39 AM

in response to: Guest

I have posted a couple of times within this forum that I would like for someone from Galloway Productions to address the science question ... can regular walk breaks lower the finishing time of "fast" marathoners?

Unfortunately, although this forum was set up for such dialogue, I haven't read any posts from Galloway Productions.

Would walking breaks assist a 100m sprinter? No.
Would walking breaks assist a 100 miler? Yes.

The interesting thing about the marathon is that it falls inbetween. I really would like to see the science. I have no problem accepting that walking would allow a lightly trained runner to turn in a faster marathon, but I wonder, as a runner's training increases, where is the point where walking would be detrimental.

Jim Sullivan032

516 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

18. Aug 3, 2005 8:44 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Wile E:
Is it me, or are the anti-anti-Gallowers coming off more beligerent here then the anti-Gallowers?? <HR>

Exactly, which is why I'd describe my position as anti-anti-anti-Galloway.

ManAlive

5 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

19. Aug 3, 2005 9:30 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Jim Sullivan:
QUOTEOriginally posted by dg12:
Whether you agree with opponents of the method or not, they're not trying to ruin the experience of finishing a marathon. They're actually on your side, so disagree with them all you want, but stop whining and misrepresenting their motivations.<HR>

But that's not what they're doing. The elitists that have been posting on this commercial forum have been denigrating anyone who dares to feel a sense of accomplishment for run-walking a marathon. There is no doubt that what you say is true - running the entire distance is a greater accomplishment - but that does not mean that run-walkers deserve the venom that has been spewed in these threads. For the love of Mike. Give it rest, people.

sue088

264 posts since
Aug 9, 1998

20. Aug 3, 2005 9:35 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by kzod:
Robin, the #3 guys are correct. Gallowalking only helps cause it forces you to pace yourself better. Most others take off too fast and bonk at the end. Until you have a firm understanding of what you can and cannot do on any given day, the breaks should help protect you from yourself,

As for the purists, if they got rid of gallowalkers, there next focus would be on getting rid of anyone slower than 10 min/mile since they aren't trained to run a marathon....<HR>

how is two different paces...pacing better??? My 9 y/o has run 5ks.....he sprints then he walks and yes, he does beat older adults that run a steady 10 minute pace. Am I encouraging him to train this way??? no. If he's going to run his one or two 5ks a year and not run a step in-between.....this is the race strategy that he has to resort to. So from what I see with a beginning runner in my son.....run/walk = no training.

I really don't care how another person gets from point A to point B. Respect comes from within, if you think you ran the marathon the best you could, then you did.

cus3435

4 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

21. Aug 3, 2005 12:06 PM

in response to: Guest

I would like to add some of my opinions here, because I have a soft spot for the Jeff Galloway plan.

The reason I say that is because when I first started out, his plan made walk breaks seem okay. This made it seem more possible for me to actually plan to do a 10k. So, I started run/walking. I don't consider myself a runner. I'm a father/husband/accountant who runs. Therefore, having a plan that's easier to stick to is better (for me)than having a strict but better training schedule. Galloway gave me this.

That being said, I have since eliminated walk breaks on all of my runs except my long run on the weekend. During these runs I walk to drink water and YES, it is mostly a mental crutch. But, I wouldn't be doing 12 miles without them. That's just the truth.

Also, I believe that a lot of the aggressive gallowalk bashing from marathons is because of semantics. They think that when a gallowalker says they RAN a marathon, it lessens the impact/impressiveness when they actually run the whole thing. And this may surprise you, I think they're right. I wish there were a way to differenciate between the two. It takes much more training to run the whole thing mentally & physically than to PLAN on taking walk breaks.

I guess I feel this way, because I know which would make me more proud. Heck, I'm more impressed with my longest non-stop run of 7 miles(10:30 pace), than I am of my weekend long w/ breaks. (10:05 pace). So, I'm sure I'd take more pride in running an entire marathon, than I would in comleting one w/ walk breaks.

PLEASE note: I would take pride in doing either, as should anyone here. We are all out there trying to make ourselves better. I wish you all the best.

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robp099

114 posts since
Oct 9, 2001

22. Aug 3, 2005 12:16 PM

in response to: Guest

I don't understand what the problem is here.... the non-galloway people should obviously be in front of the "gallow-walkers" or else their training sucks. If their training sucks, maybe they should subscribe to Galloway's plan until they have non-suck trained their way to improved times. If you don't like the run/walkers then beat them to the finish line - that's all that matters in the end.

Stardog34

81 posts since
Apr 1, 2005

23. Aug 3, 2005 2:06 PM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by dg12:
What if someone never gave you a chance to prover yourself? What if only 2:30 or faster thoners could participate? Kenyon, Ethiopian and other elites are not condescending, so hy are arrogant people so self absorbed?
<HR>

It's Kenyan, not Kenyon. Please leave my family, relatives and that college in Ohio out of it.

So, I am wondering with all the analogies flying around about something somewhat related. I have a triathlon in a couple of weeks. My weakest event is swimming. I am going to try to do the full swim freestyle (front crawl) but I might get tired and have to use the sidestroke in some place. Does that mean I can't say I swam the event? Do I have to specify that I front/sided the swim event?

Please let me know.

portlander

43 posts since
Jul 9, 2007

24. Aug 3, 2005 2:38 PM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Stardog34:
It's Kenyan, not Kenyon. Please leave my family, relatives and that college in Ohio out of it.
<HR>

As a graduate of "that college in Ohio", can I now consider myself elite?

kzod

43 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

25. Aug 4, 2005 11:31 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by srlopez:

Robin, the #3 guys are correct. Gallowalking only helps cause it forces you to pace yourself better. <HR>
That's indeed the theory. Now I'd like to see the proof.

.

Lopez,
To clarify my statement, running at an even pace is the best way to race any distance. Aiming for a negative split, which is another way of looking at it, just means increasing your intensity to hold onto that pace.

However, a huge proportion of the running population crash and burn in the long ditance event. The don't have the self-control to hold back at the start, or aren't properly trained to complete a full at their desired pace. This is where walk breaks come in handy, by forcing the runner to stop, catch their breath and retain control of themselves before they ruin the race.

I haven't done a full yet, but I've done 5 halfs so far, and I like the walk breaks. Personally, I have more respect for someone who races within their limits than a fool taking off like a headless chicken. Personal experience has taught me that I prefer ending a race strong, and while I get passed by many people in my initial walk breaks, I tend to catch most of them in the last few miles

As for those that say that Gallowalkers and walkers shouldn't enter their holy marathons, I say get your head out of your ***. I think getting people out their should be the goal. But, if we don't belong because we aren't trained to those lofty standards, I'll accept that as long as the same goes to anyone who bonks in a race and is reduced to a shuffle. Not only is the bonker not properly trained, he was too dumb to know it!

Think about that guys. And just remember that pro-Galloway runners don't rub your nose in it when you post a RR about how you went out too fast. So, if you don't like Galloway, just be a man, and walk away.

If you don't like the board accepting a commercial partner, protest by leaving the board.

kzod

43 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

26. Aug 4, 2005 11:42 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by sue:
how is two different paces...pacing better??? My 9 y/o has run 5ks.....he sprints then he walks and yes, he does beat older adults that run a steady 10 minute pace. Am I encouraging him to train this way??? no. If he's going to run his one or two 5ks a year and not run a step in-between.....this is the race strategy that he has to resort to. So from what I see with a beginning runner in my son.....run/walk = no training.

I really don't care how another person gets from point A to point B. Respect comes from within, if you think you ran the marathon the best you could, then you did.

<HR>

If you bothered to read about his training philiosophy before slamming it as untrained, it's not better pacing than an even pace. It's better than starting off fast and bonking at the end. If you hold an even pace throughout a race you don't need pacing help, if you slow down you do.

Never realized how many insecure runners there were on this board. When I started jogging, I found the real runners extremely friendly and welcoming with lots of nods and waves to anyone joining their path. You guys are so insecure about yourselves, that you slam anyone who races with a different strategy than your own regardless of how fast they do it.

That's just very sad.

To repeat: Walking breaks help you
- Slow down from the beginning
- recover faster during and after the run
- increase the distance you can safely run without injury risk.

WHile Galloway has claimed that they can even help elite athletes, I assume this is just BS to help beginners avoid the alleged stigma of not running straight through. If you are perfectly trained physically and mentally, it's not for you. But, why blast people who either aren't at that level, or aren't ready to give them up? That's like me going into the newbie area and laughing at those fat fools who can't run a 20 minute 5k. Get over yourselves.

Stevie Ray Lopez

532 posts since
Dec 3, 2007

27. Aug 4, 2005 11:45 AM

in response to: Guest

If most of that is directed at me, then you may want to re-read my posts. I've actually been extremely supportive. Tried to be, at least.

I do want to see some data (someday) that shows that this is an 1) optimal, 2) suboptimal, or 3) "just another" way to train. I totally question the idea that this definitely helps people be faster... that's not code for "you're wrong; you suck"... it's just an open, realistic question based on the lack of solid data I've seen. If it turns out that #1 is true, then great.

I am one of those people who decided that running the whole way was a more meaningful goal for myself. For that, I get looked down by the fast runners who think I just need to train harder. And I get looked down by some of the runwalkers and called elitist. What? That's just nutty.

But I learned over the past few years that when it comes to physical activity and sport, someone is going to look down on me no matter what. That's just how it goes. So I ignore it.

Now, if most of that post was not directed at me... then ok.

kzod

43 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

28. Aug 4, 2005 11:49 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Stardog34:
It's Kenyan, not Kenyon. Please leave my family, relatives and that college in Ohio out of it.

So, I am wondering with all the analogies flying around about something somewhat related. I have a triathlon in a couple of weeks. My weakest event is swimming. I am going to try to do the full swim freestyle (front crawl) but I might get tired and have to use the sidestroke in some place. Does that mean I can't say I swam the event? Do I have to specify that I front/sided the swim event?

Please let me know.

<HR>

Once, I'm replying to everyone. Real triathletes like real runners are accepting of all, unless you don't follow proper etiquette and slow them down by your own bad behavior.

I just did my 1st sprint tri in Montreal, where many of the racers were close to elite. It was the best experience of my life. They were extremely friendly, corteous, and helpful and in return I tried to stay out of their way when I was getting passed in the pool and bike.

Same thing at a marathon, just seed yourself properly at the start and everyone should be happy.

Jim Sullivan032

516 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

29. Aug 4, 2005 11:49 AM

in response to: Guest

quote:<HR>Originally posted by kzod:
So, if you don't like Galloway, just be a man, and walk away.<HR>

As a corollary, if you don't like critics of the method, be a man and don't paticipate in threads that exist not to promte the system but only to take cheap shots at people with different views. Be a man.

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