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12 Replies Last post: Apr 24, 2007 9:07 AM by jtv079  
Click to view twinmomrunner045's profile Pro 133 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
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Apr 19, 2007 8:50 PM

Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00

I just finished my first Boston as a charity runner. It was an awesome experience, and I was very happy with my 4:12, despite some mistakes (went out too fast, and had a 5 minute positive split). But now I've got the bug and want to do better. My BQ is 4:00 (which I know is a fast walk for many on this board, but please indulge me). I'd like to get there in the next couple of years. So the question is how...

I'm very comfortable with distance (lots of 20+ milers), but even in shorter races I'm not too fast (8:30 pace for a 5 miler). So I'm thinking that rather than jump into another marathon, I should work on my 5mile to half marathon times for a while. Does that make sense? If so, can anyone recommend a schedule? Most plans seem to be geared to a particular race, but I just want a general training schedule for now, ideally averaging about 30-35 mpw, and I can slot in races as they come up. Once I'm in better speed shape, I can gear up to a schedule like the Pfitz 55 mpw one which I used for Boston. Would appreciate any advice.

Thanks!
Click to view uli f's profile Expert 57 posts since
Feb 24, 2006
1. Apr 20, 2007 4:30 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
I honestly believe that you should simply enter a flat marathon and hope for decent conditions. I think you have the fitness to even pace yourself to a 3:59 if you managed a 4:12 in Boston this year given the course profile and the conditions. Just keep your training as it is and it should lead you where you want to be. trust yourself!

Good luck!

uli
Click to view inchon7781's profile Amateur 9 posts since
Nov 29, 2006
2. Apr 20, 2007 4:56 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
Ditto what uli f said. Your fitness is there...just stay consistent with training.
Click to view How we Run's profile Pro 68 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
3. Apr 20, 2007 8:58 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
4:12 in those conditions and the Boston course? Congratulations!
Train through the summer, do some good speed work, follow a good program and given the right day you'll get that BQ real soon.
Click to view Richard21142's profile Legend 774 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
4. Apr 20, 2007 9:06 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
quote:<HR>Originally posted by twinmomrunner:
I
I'm very comfortable with distance (lots of 20+ milers), but even in shorter races I'm not too fast (8:30 pace for a 5 miler). So I'm thinking that rather than jump into another marathon, I should work on my 5mile to half marathon times for a while.
<HR>


Another opinion: If you are slow at 5 miles, then the lots of 20 milers aren't getting you faster. You should work on your times from the mile to the half-marathon. You would then discover that shorter races can be pretty exciting. Then when you are ready to gear up for a marathon, you will find that the long runs won't be as tedious as they are without 5K speed.
Click to view DanMoriarity's profile Legend 823 posts since
Dec 14, 2007
6. Apr 21, 2007 10:32 PM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
I know it's already been said, but I have to agree that a 4:12 in Boston this year would be worth a sub 4 on a fast course in good conditions. Just stay consistent in your training and it will come.
Click to view runninirish's profile Legend 233 posts since
Feb 26, 2007
7. Apr 22, 2007 11:45 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
I agree with several of the above posts...you are very close to sub 4:00...for what it's worth, to get myself into BQ shape, I spent one summer preparing for a 10K as my goal race...the following spring I dropped 30 mins off my marathon and ran a 3:10...I think the previous summer helped me get my legs in the "fast" mind frame...but I think a flat course and a good day would have you at sub 4.

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"Fortitudine vincimus"
Click to view Budget3's profile Expert 40 posts since
Aug 16, 2007
8. Apr 22, 2007 12:01 PM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
You may or may not be ready for a 4:00 marathon, but between the lines you are asking to get faster. Speed is strength plus endurance, so add the runs that will make you stronger, like hill repeats. At your level alternate them weekly with a proper tempo run. To improve (train) you must add to your workload in order to stress your body to adapt to a higher level.
Click to view Eely's profile Amateur 8 posts since
Jun 18, 2006
9. Apr 22, 2007 12:23 PM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
It took me 15 marathons to get under 4 - last year and this year at Boston I finally did it. Prior to 2006, my marathons (2 to 3 a year) were all within 30 mins of each other - my first was 4:17 (2000 in Boston); then I did 4:03, 4:04; 4:10, 4:14....with my worst time being 4:38, best time 4:01. You get the drift. Like you twinmomrunner, I had no problems with distance, and my 10k pace was only 30 secs or so different from my marathon pace. I ran alone most of the time, did very sporadic speedwork, by myself, when I felt like it (which was hardly ever).

What I did was find a coach, which was much less expensive than I thought it would be. I did a combination of online schedules, with occasional one on one in person meetings. The schedules fit into my busy work/life. I ended up running less miles, but better training miles. I got much more all-round athletic. I did speedwork and faster long runs on a regular basis. My time this year was 3:57:54 at Boston. It felt great and totally worth it. I definitely could have run faster in different conditions.

I still run alone most of the time, because I prefer to train that way. Not being in charge of my own training schedule, though, was huge. I did every workout, (even when I didn't feel like running fast . So that worked for me. Cost of the coaching service = approx. 20 pizzas . That's my justification. If you can't do coaching, I think a reputable training program that included 1 day speedwork/interval training and faster long runs would work.

The intangible aspects of the coaching were 1. small mental/physical tips that got me through the final 6 miles of the marathon (don't look down...shake out my quads, do a high kick every mile); 2. I pushed myself out of my comfort zone.

When I qualified (finally!) for Boston last year, I took the fall of 06 and trained for a half-marathon, instead. Training for a shorter race helped a lot - I did a pr of 1:52 (my previous 1/2 pr was 1:57). I'm a 49 y/o woman, btw.
Sorry to ramble, but your post kind of told my story. Good luck - you can totally do it, if I did it.

Ellen
Click to view jparry's profile Pro 111 posts since
Oct 27, 2005
10. Apr 23, 2007 5:28 PM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
All of the above: you sound close to sub-4 already. Ontop of the existing training (good that you have plenty of 20 milers on the go) Why not add speedwork -- maybe 800 repeats in particular could serve well to put higher octane fuel in the tank for 10k through half-marathon distances. In retrospect, without overdoing it, a training cycle that includes several half marathons, run hard, preferably 4/6 weeks apart is likely to yield a good marathon. Best of luck.


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Click to view jtv079's profile Legend 252 posts since
Jan 13, 2006
12. Apr 24, 2007 9:07 AM in response to: twinmomrunner045
Re: Life After Boston: Help me to get to 4:00
I think with the training you did for Boston, that you shouldn't have much problem running 4:00. In fact, I always ran 20-30 minutes slower in Boston than I did in Fall marathons. I would take a short break, then try some shorter races in the spring/early summer. You may surprise yourself in that you may have gained speed from following Pfitz 55 program. Then switch to marathon training in the summer for a fall marathon.

Good Luck!