800s...the death of me.

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Balufudus

25 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

Jul 7, 2004 11:07 AM

800s...the death of me.

i just started doing the yasso 800s and have got to say that these are absolutely brutal, especially the last couple.

i'm gunning for a 3 hour 45 minute marathon and the first couple are ok then it's just a battle of will. it's my first time doing these and they're **** tough.

anyone else do these? anyone have an idea of when my fitness should pick up enough where i don't feel like i'm dying on the last one or two?

CoachB008

777 posts since
Apr 27, 2000

1. Jul 7, 2004 1:41 PM

in response to: Balufudus

10 x 800m is a good workout, however, don't be beguiled into trying to run all your 800's at the same goal marathon time (i.e. 3:45 for a 3:45 marathon) I don't think that there is any real correlation between that workout and your eventual marathon time (i think it's something that joggers world made up to sell more magazines)

In marathon training, the most important thing is to get comfortable running lots of mileage. If you are secure in a good solid mileage base, then the 800's may give you a decent idea of what kind of marathon time you can run. However, if your mileage and long runs and tempo runs arent there, then the 800's won't tell you anything apart from how fast you can run 10 x 800.

Here is an example. In college, I could easily run 10 x 800 in under 2:24, but there is no way I would have come close to 2:24 for the marathon. I would have been lucky to go under 3:00, simply because my mileage was not high enough and my longest runs were only around 13 miles; capice?

Balufudus

25 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

2. Jul 7, 2004 1:57 PM

in response to: Balufudus

as of right now my mileage is on the low side because i just recently came off of a marathon (boston) but i never had a problem with the mileage during the training for that one. for this 2nd marathon (nyc), i'm looking to better on the time and from what i read the 800 repeats seemed the way to go.

my schedule is as follows:
monday: weights (squats, leg press, calves, d1/d2s, hammy curls and misc upper body stuff) and cross training

tuesday: 800 repeats (starting at 4 repeats and working up to 14 repeats)

wednesday: easy run of 3-5 miles

thursday: 7-9 mile semi long runs usually with hills (i live in boston so i just do the heartbreak hills and run back into town)

friday: rest

saturday: 4-6 mile runs at 5k, 10k or marathon pace

sunday: long runs with the really long runs every other week.

with this schedule, i think i'm hitting all the different workouts that you mentioned (tempo, long, etc.). i'll give the 800 repeats a try for this marathon and see if my 2nd marathon time is around 3:45:00. for my first marathon, my goal was surviving. from here on in, i'd like to improve on my times and in 2-3 years qualify for boston instead of going the charity route. i guess we'll see what happens.

thanks for the advice though.

ahuesman

2 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

3. Jul 9, 2004 11:05 AM

in response to: Balufudus

I actually just started doing these as well. My goal time for Chicago is 3:30, so I have been running my repeats slightly faster than that. This week, I did 4 repeats in 90 degree weather. Like you (and especially on that day), I felt like dying at the end of the workout. Makes me look forward to the day where I have to put in 10 per workout.

I really hope they work! I'll know for sure in October.

Balufudus

25 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

4. Jul 9, 2004 11:08 AM

in response to: Balufudus

funny to think that the feeling of death knocking on your doorstep is actually the feeling of you getting more physically fit.

i wonder when i'm actually dying if i'll get confused and think that somehow i'm getting healthier...

AndyHass

1,385 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

5. Jul 9, 2004 11:27 AM

in response to: Balufudus

Yassos are meant to be a predictor (and they are a POOR one), not an actual workout. The pace at which you should do 800s depends partly upon how much recovery you take and really "Yasso pace" is a poor way to go to get the most out of them.
I usually do 8-10X800 with 90 sec jogging recovery and run them at approximately 5k pace. For marathon training, you don't need to do them all out! If you are really destroying yourself with them, you are doing them either too fast or too many.
I notice you're trying to run them in 3:45 right now? Do you feel you are in 3:45 shape right now, or is that just your goal for nyc? If you are NOT in 3:45 shape, you should not be running Yassos in 3:45...you should be running them that fast in the last weeks leading up to the race. Maybe they should be 3:50 or 3:55 now?
Your schedule looks decent, though low on miles for a marathon. Forget doing 14X800 on your mileage, I don't run that many on 100 mile weeks. Your time is better spent running a few more miles.

Born to Run060

557 posts since
Jul 1, 2002

6. Dec 20, 2007 11:37 PM

in response to: Balufudus

Intervals always hurt. They get easier in an odd way though.

I agree with Coach B. I think you'd do better to add another long tempo at half-marathon pace on tuesday than do the 800's. Then you could run longer on wednesday too and work on getting those miles up. If you want to work on your speed endurance you could do a fartlek in place of the 800's. This way you are also getting a long aerobic run in. You could do something like 10 X 3:45 w/ 3 minute back-to-pace breaks. Of course, these will be slower than on the track as they are non-stop, but these will really raise your aerobic capacity and lactic threshold as well. They will help with your tempo, which will help with your racing.

I think someone running anything over a 3 hour marathon benefits way more from endurance-- aeorbic type running than from doing intervals on the track--it's not speed that they need to work on. Of course, if you really love runng 8's on the track you can keep the rest a jog and make it more of a fartlek type workout. Also, I suggest leaving the watch at home. Learn to feel your body and don't worry about the time. You can only do what you can do and the time will come.

http://This message has been edited by Born to Run (edited Jul-09-2004).

Balufudus

25 posts since
Dec 14, 2007

7. Jul 9, 2004 11:40 AM

in response to: Balufudus

"You could do something like 10 X 3:45 w/ 3 minute back-to-pace breaks. Of course, these will be slower than on the track as they are non-stop, but these will really raise your aerobic capacity and lactic threshold as well. They will help with your tempo, which will help with your racing."

Born to run -

for the intervals are you supposed to be resting (as in just standing there?) up until now, what i have been doing is doing an interval then walking one 400 (about 3 minutes) then picking up on another interval. i could try the jogging for 3 minutes instead of just walking.

AndyHaas -

3:45:00 is my goal for nyc. as of right now, the 3:45 minute 800s are fine for the first couple then the last few are tougher.

Born to Run060

557 posts since
Jul 1, 2002

8. Jul 9, 2004 12:17 PM

in response to: Balufudus

The rest can be done in different ways, which will change the workout. It could be a timed short or equal time complete rest, a short jog, or an equal time or longer jog. I think the jog would be of more benefit for marathon training. Maybe Coach B can also give his opinion on this?

Jul 7, 2004 11:07 AM

800s...the death of me.

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