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5394 Views 47 Replies Latest reply: Aug 17, 2011 4:08 AM by NELL_blue RSS 1 2 3 4 Previous Next
NELL_blue Legend 303 posts since
May 21, 2010
Currently Being Moderated

Aug 12, 2011 8:41 AM

What to do if you see bad, consistently poor umpiring?

Do you ignore it?  Tell someone at District?  Or keep your mouth shut?





Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it!

  • beowulf37 Legend 219 posts since
    May 25, 2007

    Depends on who "you" are.  Are you a ADA or DA?  League official?  Parent?  Rat?  Fellow umpire?

     

    And define "bad".  Poor mechanics?  Bad eyesight?  Poor game management?

     

    Is it just one umpire or an entire crew or roster?  

     

    Way too many variables here to answer.

  • beowulf37 Legend 219 posts since
    May 25, 2007

    I'm not really in the habit of making things up.  That's a habit generally reserved for rats.

     

    If you're simply a spectator - parent usually - then you can ask your kid's coach about it.  Maybe you're the one missing things and not the umpire.

     

    If the coach agrees with you, then he probably should have already contacted his league VP - each division usually has a VP.  From there it goes up the chain - President, BOD, UIC.

    Since this is LL and umpires are generally volunteers, there is very little training that takes place (in general).  Some leagues have strong umpire training programs, although very few.

     

    If you NOT talking about LL (or other youth ball), there is generally an assignor that deals with members of an association.  High School and above have evaluators at most games and they are the ones that address these types of issues.

     

    If I'm umpiring with somone who is missing a lot of calls, it's usually a positioning issue.  That's something we can go over in pre and post game conversations.  With inexperienced kids, I've found that they'll generally listen and try to learn.  Older guys are harder to deal with, becasue (they think) they've been doing this a long time and know what they're doing.  In LL, If I'm with a guy who refuses to adapt his mechanics and continues to miss calls, I might say something to the assignor.  Beyond LL, it's not my responsibility to address poor performance.

     

    And to your scenario #3 - "arguing" in and of itself is "unprofessional"  Rats argue.  Managers can ask questions and ask for rulings.  They don't have the option of "arguing".  I don't argue with rats.

  • ManikSona Expert 55 posts since
    Aug 11, 2011

    I was just browsing through all the threads on the forum (I'm new here) and I came across this post and it peaked my curiousity.  This was really good advise beowulf37.  I'm not an expert in baseball by any stretch of the imagination, but it does seem like parents get a little crazy when it comes to their kids games, something I've been dreading as my oldest is starting baseball this fall.  It seems like all the arguing parents take the fun out of the game for the kids.  Anyway, I just wanted to compliment you on your answer.  Thanks!





    Manik Runner - Training for a Marathon

  • TheMouth__1 Legend 917 posts since
    May 30, 2007

    I see Beowulf has formed even another name to go under........LOL  Playing Possum probably.    TM

  • TheMouth__1 Legend 917 posts since
    May 30, 2007

    If Coaches are Rats, that would make Umpires Skunks, which are rats that stink.    TM

  • beowulf37 Legend 219 posts since
    May 25, 2007

    Rat is a term used to describe coaches - not ALL coaches, but the rats know who they are.

     

    I used to entertain questions from "spectators" all the time, becasue I, too, am a fairly regualar presence at the local fields.  Notice I used the past tense.  People eventually got sick of my answer, which invariably ended with "I'm glad you're taking such an interest in the rules.  When can we expect you to volunteer for games.  We're dying for umpires."  *Poof*  They simply disappeared.  Like magic.

  • TheMouth__1 Legend 917 posts since
    May 30, 2007

    Can we make you go POOF??    TM

  • BlueBeak Legend 300 posts since
    Nov 26, 2002

    1) You consistently see a base umpire missing calls, due to bad eyesight, positioning, whatever. Who do I complain to?

     

    The most times that I have seen these types of boo-boos is when working with a newbie. I've been fortunate that in these scenarios, they frequently ask my advice. So I instruct them on positioning/mechanics as the situation dictates. In the few instances where they are just not getting better, I'm usually asked by the UIC for evaluations so believe me, I am telling them that they should keep the guy on a short leash.

     

    2) Consistently missing Infield Fly, Obstruction or other scenerios.

     

    Not including newbies(as they will get my advice regularly) some guys I've worked with seem to think that they are only there to call balls, strikes, outs, and safes. I did a Distict Championship game this year in a 4 man crew I was U1 on a 90 ft diamond. Bases were juiced and the batter hits a chopper to F6 who comes in to field the ball and gets boxed out by R2 heading to 3rd. Clearly (let me repeat CLEARLY) interference but neither U2 nor U3 signal it, but I do (no question it was interference). I'm getting chastised by O fans, cuz they say" it wasn't my call", but I saw it and would call it again. My partners got an instruction from our District UIC (on their slip up) who was in attendance and in agreement with the INT call. So, I guess I need not "report" this one, but I would have.

     

     

    3) Argueing with the managers unprofessionally? (In my opinion, or yours?)

     

    Some guys will do this. Let their tempers get the best of them. If they are repeat offenders, they won't last long IMO. If its isolated (perhaps dealing with a rat?), hopefully learn from it and move on.

     

     

    4) Not knowing the rules?

     

    We confer on rulings on the field. I always endeavour to correct my partner on a misapplied ruling (in private) and I pray that they will always help me see the error of my ways should it happen. But again, the UIC or assignor needs to be made aware of any maverick out there.





    Time wounds all heels.....

  • Rich_Ives Legend 1,283 posts since
    May 25, 2007

    If the UIC tells you you're out of position he's teaching.

    If a coach tells you you're out of position he's a rat

     

    If the UIC suggests you need to work on the consistency of your ball/strike calls he's teaching.

    If a coach does it he's a rat.

     

    If you think slash bunts should be banned and the coach has a player do one - he's a rat.

     

    If anyone has the audacity to question one of your calls - he's a rat.

     

    If you disagree with Beowulf on a rule interpretion, you're a rat.

     

    If you think an action away from the ball, with no effect on the play is not intrrtference - you're a rat.

     

    If you disagree with Beowulf on how a league should be administered, you're a rat.

     

    If you think Grendel came out of the fight with Beowulf OK, you're Beowulf37  (remember that one Beo?).

     

    My avatar is a rat on the boards with avatars.

     

    Most places and most folks recognize that you can disagree and not be an enemy of the state.

     

    "Different" and "Wrong" are not synonyms.

  • TheMouth__1 Legend 917 posts since
    May 30, 2007

    Wow Rich, now that post sounds like a "God Complex".  To throw all coaches into the same category is very discriminatory.  I knew Beowulf was but you too?  Unless of course you are Beowulfs' alter ego??    If I as a coach (and Umpire) I see one bad Ump, do I say they are all bad?   Don't think I do.   This Board could do with a lot less Beowulf BS.    TM

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